farmers for action

by Veganarchist Sat Jul 21, 2012 16:10

While I sympathize with people potentially loosing their jobs and quite possibly their livelihoods, I can't help but wonder if this is the price you pay for needlessly exploiting animals for profit?

Dairy cows are artificially inseminated in order to produce milk for their offspring which are taken from them shortly after birth. The dairy industry relies on this systematic rape and kidnapping to survive and is another example of the violence inherent in the animal industry.

Maybe those dairy farmers who are feeling the pinch due to the cuts in milk prices should put themselves in the shoes of the animals they are exploiting. These cows receive nothing in exchange for their milk, not even the meager 45p per litre that the dairy farmers are complaining about, the most they may get is death once they have reached the end of their productivity.

Instead of complaining about the cut in dairy prices, maybe now is the time to see the light, sell-up and move into another form of agriculture that does not rely on the wholesale torture and commodification of animals.

Solidarity to those who are taking up the fight against big business and governments alike, but just remember, you are not the bottom of the ladder! There are animals suffering below you and their voices will go unheard unless we are willing to stand up for them!

by farmer palmer Sat Jul 21, 2012 22:00

It's not the mud on there hands it's the blood i'm concerned about!
How many of these farmers are also pro badger cull i wonder! Basically it seems alot of farmers simply like killing things - if there not raising animals for slaughter they are hunting,shooting,fishing,trapping, poisoning, destroying there habitats. They act in a way that most normal,decent people find repulsive! I think people should grow vegetables,fruits,grains etc on a small scale,locally. People should grow vegetables instead of having wasteful lawns. Seriously alot of these these people are not nice,they are the UK equivalent of rednecks! And i feel qualified saying this after spending 5 years as a huntsab and seeing the way these farmers and country bumpkins behave!

here are some links i found interesting -

http://www.stockfreeorganic.net/

http://badger-killers.co.uk/

by Mr JJJ Sat Jul 21, 2012 22:40

Fair play I say - blockade the processors and name and shame the supermarket buyers. The big supermarkets are trying to re-shape agriculture in this country, to fit their needs and to keep it firmly under their thumb. We need small farms, we need grass-fed meat and dairy, we need traditional, regional cheese and meat products, we need knobbly vegetables and rough cider (well, I do, anyway). And most of all we need to keep the land in productive use, making good food for local consumption, and we need the knowledge that's there in old farming families to be passed on to future generations so that we can feed ourselves sustainably. Up the farmers, and fuck Tescos!

by Dan Factor Sat Jul 21, 2012 22:48

...do people protesting for a decent living wage for their jobs only get the backing from anarchists if they agree with the jobs they are doing then?

by Devil Sad Vocate Sat Jul 21, 2012 23:37

Yes, I agree, all farmers are inbred reactionaries who torture animals. Let's drive this point home. Let's shout it in every village, as we come up from the city to sab hunts. But why not include the whole rural community in righteous condemnation too, as they service these sadists and work for them?

And wait a minute, why not carry our impeccable logic to its logical conclusion? Let us stop our misguided support for Zapatista peasants and Colombian indigenous peoples right away. Why have we been so blind? These pig/chicken torturers and murderers are farmers too!

Rural people really have no idea how to live with nature. We will show them, by digging up our manicured bourgeois lawns and growing vegetables. And when bugs and slugs attack our crops, we will speak to them nicely and they will go away.

by well seasoned Sun Jul 22, 2012 01:26

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-8MhIK2x0U&feature=iv&a...89745

by badgerboy - CBAG Sun Jul 22, 2012 09:15 stopthebadgercull at gmail dot com

Farmers feed their cows a 19% protein mix, this contains GM soya, the group gm freeze found that none of the supermarkets have policies of a "no-gm" for animal feed policy.

soya products for humans do not contain gm (well apart from beanfeast and bacobits) so drinking soya milk (there are no gm soya milks for sale in the uk) reduces the demand for GM

the dairy herd in the uk suffers mastitis at a rate of about 40%, because of this a "somatic cell count" of about 1% is allowable in milk, thats about 1 teaspoon per pint, somatic cell count=puss, mastitis is a very painful disease, made worse by the amount of milk cows produce, in the 1940 a cow would produce about 2,000kg of milk a year now its 9-15,000kg a year.

laminitis was described to me by a vet as similar to having your fingers crushed in a door and then walkiing on them, again laminitis is linked to farming methods.

both of these diseases mean lots of anti-biotics being fed to cows, which ends up in milk.

dairy farmers plan to start free shooting of badgers with high powered rifles, the bullets if missing their targets can travel 2-3 miles, so when someone does end up getting shot (a farmer shot his step son accidentally during a deer cull) you'll know the exact price of a pint of milk

by farmer palmer Sun Jul 22, 2012 17:59

this is a response to Dan Factor who said -

"...do people protesting for a decent living wage for their jobs only get the backing from anarchists if they agree with the jobs they are doing then?"

In reply i would say a big fat yes people protesting for a decent living wage do only get our support when we agree with them...thats why we didn't support the filth when they went on a demo asking for more money! -http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/may/10/police-officer...-cuts
in fact there was a small counter demo called by class war i think.

I hate cops and animal farmers cos they are both part of a abusive regime/mindset.

by anonymous vegan Sun Jul 22, 2012 18:38

As a vegan, I too feel uneasy supporting dairy farmers given the inherent injustice of the dairy industry. But...

a) The blanket anti-farmer prejudice above is bullshit.

b) If farmers lose out in a fight against the supermarkets, the price of milk will fall, and only large-scale dairy farms will survive. The result will be a worsening of conditions for cows.

I still feel conflicted enough that I'm not about to join the farmers on their blockades and pickets, and I'm not saying anyone else should if they don't feel comfortable doing so. But... think twice before slagging them off. Moral purism is just too easy a cop-out.

by farmer palmer Sun Jul 22, 2012 20:52

"Not vegan, will never be vegan
by One of the 99.3% (of non vegans) Sun Jul 22, 2012 19:07
Got a problem with that? If so, STFU and keep daydreaming about the day that will never come when you get all the evil speciesists hung from lampposts."

A well rounded and articulate argument...well done sir! ( or madam ) Your intelligence,whit,and eloquence have caused me to reconsider my veganism. Despite having been a vegan for over a decade, the sheer strength of your argument alone, in those beautifully sculpted words, lovingly formed into a sentence, have made me have a epiphany.

No longer shall i avoid eating animals and their byproducts...well it's still considered socially unacceptable to eat some animals like cats and dogs but other animals are fair game i reckon. Foie Gras and veal for dinner!

No longer shall i say it's wrong to wear the skins and fur of animals...except human animals, that would be really weird - imagine wearing the skin or fur of an animal that could actually feel pain, have emotions and communicate!

No longer...oh i can't be bothered to think of anymore..oh and you will be vegan one day because you will one day die and all dead people are vegans by default - ha ha! ( this was meant to be humours so please don't get angry ) xvx ;-)

by lort Sun Jul 22, 2012 22:13

Reading some of the reactionary replies to the original post has reminded me why I can't be an anarchist in today's society.

If people think agricultural livestock is wrong, they should protest against it. But if somebody has no qualms with it, but does have inklings towards anarchism in other areas, it is quite ostracising. To really be included as part of the anarchist community it's not enough to advocate a stateless, non-hierarchical society, we have to conform to other ideals too.

It's these viewpoints that turn some people away from anarchy. Me anyway.

by jbard Mon Jul 23, 2012 00:36

Protip: Not all Anarchists are vegans.

This one's a vegetarian.

by Not all Tue Jul 24, 2012 14:25

Not the case, and if anyone tries to enforce lifestyle choices such as veganism or punk rock or wearing black as 'necessary credentials' for being labelled an anarchist, then they are no longer anarchists, but members of a subculture fashion cult and consumers of a certain lifestyle.

Anarchism is supposed by its very nature to incorporate a very wide range of individual opinions. This is key to its whole appeal and energy. However, there are some 'anarchists' who would like 'their wee club' to be more ideologically identikit, and by implication just as moribund and politically marginalised, as the SWP.

I think the ignorant and stereotyped attacks on 'farmers' here, just because they are part of the dairy industry, are pathetic. It shows a level of moral indignation that has no base in either class analysis or agricultural/ecological knowledge.

By all means promote your beliefs, if you truly believe in them. Many of the arguments for vegetarianism and veganism make good sense. But you won't persuade anyone by recoiling in horror from them simply because they eat meat or dairy and/or are involved in some employment capacity in these industries.

by falmer palmer Tue Jul 24, 2012 16:08

yeah - i think i agree with you.My comments were a bit childish but i really do think that alot of farmers,weather big or small ( in relation to the size of land they farm not their height ) are racist and sexist and backwards in many ways. I think ( in response to someone elses comment ) there's a differnce between the people of the zapatista resistance ( many of them small farmers ) and our bumpkins as i would see our farmers more in the same light as the rednecks of the deep south and the Zapatista farmers as oppressed people, uniting with other oppressed people to fight back for the land that they live on. Farming is one of the most heavily subsidised industry's in Britain so i don't really see them as being oppressed by the government! Also as i've pointed out before,i don't see them uniteing with any other struggles...not ours anyway, mabe the BNP and the EDL but not the left!

Apologies for spelling mistakes and ramblingness - i'm on my tbreak and typeing quickly!

by farmers son Tue Jul 24, 2012 19:27

Ok I suppose I have to admit that I am a racist, sexist, badger and fox killing inbred, mother fucking weirdo and fascist who only eats meat and shoots vegans and hippies for breakfast.

(All these insults taken from comments section including ones hidden by the moderator!)

by C. Rose Tue Jul 24, 2012 20:41

Well done you!... acknowledging your present condition is the first step towards recovery, healing and beneficial personality change, would you like the numbers of a couple of therapists / counsellors to assist you on your path towards becoming a part of the solution?
If you pull your finger out a bit sharpish like you might still be able to get a few sessions thru the NHS, thats if those fuckwit Tories have not slashed the funding already.

by nice clean boy Tue Jul 24, 2012 22:17

Yes mr farmers son I bet you are all smelly and dirty with a red neck so why don’t you go and have a bath in a sheep dip.

by alan Tue Jul 24, 2012 22:47

Don't forget you no doubt drive a 4x4 which makes you even WORSE than the combined sins you have been good enough to admit to in the eyes of some!

Nice touch of irony (or maybe just a piss take?) either way well done - I suspect you are more mentally stable than most on here - as exemplified by the calls for you to have "therapy".

This is the stock answer for those bizarre types who quite happily consider those that dare to disagree with them as being mentally ill or in need of "therapy".

Googling regimes in the world that used that logic is more than a little illuminating.

So much for their "better world" :0)

Rest assured that the average jo(e) in the street is not represented by the extremes on here!!

by Lucy Tue Jul 24, 2012 23:55

How's those Hemorrhoids of yours doing?

by Alan Wed Jul 25, 2012 08:24

Nice to see yo ability to remain on topic and not making it personal is still at the same low level as ever Lucy. As for anyones haemeroids!! How are yours looking? After all out of all of us you are the one with your head up your arse more than most - so you are best placed to judge.

by farmer palmer Wed Jul 25, 2012 15:35

Hi...
er this is all getting a bit silly isn't it. I've been trying to respond to people's comments and talk about it semi seriously. By that i mean to say i've been trying to be humours in my delivery but also put forward/defend a position i find very serious ( veganism/ animal rights ). Am i the only person on here who is actually trying to follow the conversation and engage in a debate ?

Not massively sure what hemorrids have to do with owt. If people continue to be random and not actually answer the arguments/counter arguments do i win and if so what's my prize? !

If i've missed some really good ( pro farmer ) argument or some well articulated comment then i apologise - post it again and i'll respond. It dus seem to me that as soon as some one mentioned the dreaded V word people get really deffensive and shitty...i wonder why this happens only with veganism and animal rights. I doubt anyone would respond to a post/comment by No Borders stating that they don't care about the plight of migrant's and never will! Dunno maybe i'm over reacting but i've noticed it a few times.

here's a link to a website bout violent hunt scum ( obviously including a fair few farmers! ) - http://www.realca.co.uk/

So that one example ( well the website has loads of individual examples ) of farmers/huntscum acting in a really shitty manner - here's my challenge to the pro farmer folk - find me a example or two of farmers acting in a really nice positive manner! Show me the pictures of the farmers block on demonstrations. Type in a report of uk farmers, uniting in struggle with the workers/students as opposed to simply trying to better conditions for themselves.....i am not holding my breath.!

tell you what let me be less one sided - i've included a anti bloodsports link why not have a look at the countryside alliance's website. Read what the bloodthirsty, total scum fucks of the c.a. have to say - http://www.countryside-alliance.org/ca/ ... if they manage to convince you of anything then there really is no hope left! ( it's the country side alliance for fucks sake! )

by a piece of scum Wed Jul 25, 2012 18:48

Can you explain why you think farmers, in particular small tenant farmers, would support blood sports? The last thing you want if you are trying to make a living out of the land is a bunch of upper class morons riding their horses over your crops and smashing down your hedges. Just as many people in the countryside are against blood sports as in the cities

The countryside alliance, which represents big landowners and the ruling classes in the countryside, is hated by most tenant farmers who have to pay their supporters rent.

by falmer palmer Wed Jul 25, 2012 23:33

Hi Mr Scum!
first of all i'd suggest you had self esteem issues choosing " a piece of scum" as your alias but there you go. Secondly thank you for a lucid and well put argument...sadly i think i still disagree. I think you were saying/implying small tenant farmers would be anti hunt. I think that a farmer - either small tenant or large land owner may/not have a problem with the hunt for the following reasons-

Reasons why your ruddy cheeked " good ole boys " may not have a problem with the local hunt

1) The farmer in question - if a animal farmer may very well have his/her " fallen stock " taken away free of charge by the hunt to be fed to the hounds at the local hunt kennels... this includes cows and calfs by the way.

2) The hunt,sadly, is a part of the rural community... a shitty and unnecessary part... but a part non the less. The hunt will employ and be supported by the local bumpkins and there friends and relatives so your farmer, large or small will be immersed in the bloody culture of death. His/her neighbours, the people in the local village pub,local bussiness's etc will all be involved.

3) bloody culture of death sounded a bit melodramatic didn't it...sori

Haveing said all that - yeah some country people and yeah i spose some small farmers are anti hunt - they are bullied and abused. They may be anti hunt cos-

1) It's obviously cruel - i find it hard to believe many small tenant farmers are anti hunt for the above reasons but yeah some may find it cruel and not want to support it...i've not heard many tales of these people though in all honesty

2) They may be sick of the bullying that comes from the hunnting community that comes if you try to oppose them, i have heard that people in tied houses/cottages, agri workers, serfs etc were forced on the country side alliance marchs all those years ago with the threat of losing there jobs if they didn't go. There was a article in the land magazine about this. Also tales of being ostracised if you live in the country and are anti hunt/don't want them on your land etc

Can you point me to any good websites/or organisations of tenant farmers who are anti hunt? Or left leaning in anyway?...i think my argument about the attitudes of farmers, both towards animals and other people, although originally put forward in a imature and possibly angry, in many way's still holds.

Dunno - not sure how well written this is as i'm tired but hope it makes some semblence of sense...feel free to respond.
cheers

by farmers boy Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:57

I will see you at he picket outside the council offices tonight at 5pm where we will be defending services for the elderly and the disabled. You can then call me scum to my face. We need a more inclusive class warfare politics and less of your elitist lifestyle subculture politics if we are going to make a better world

by falmer palmer Thu Jul 26, 2012 14:03

but well done for going on the picket...if,as you say you are a farmers son and your going on the picket...great well done. Will you be leaveing from the farm you live at with a big possie of all those left leaning farmers we keep hearing so much about,with your farm workers union banner..... or have you left home,live in the city and do not have your farthers aproval...as his a racist,sexist backward ass redneck etc? Just asking... obviously i've no idea about your farther - he could be a lovely person for all i know and i don't wan't to cause offense, i'm just trying to make a point. Even if you are comeing from the farm and some farm folk are left leaning ( as i think you are trying to suggest ) i think you are in the vast minority. Hopefully i'm wrong.

If i do get out of work in time to say hi how will i recognise you? will you be holding the red and black flag quoteing Bakunin or holding a armfull of class war/ freedom newspapers?...again just asking
ok? thanx, bye